1992 Philadelphia Eagles discussion

[74_75_78_79_]

This current signing of Saquon Barkley is sort-of reminding me of that '92 Birds' campaign! Herschel, of course, was the key acquisition at RB that year. Logic indicated at the time that, despite already having Keith Byars, that a main-purpose marquee RB was needed in Philly to complement Cunningham who'd now return as well as Herschel, at least seemingly, being in a better place considering Minny's, at least apparent, misuse of him; Saquon, at least seemingly, being in a better place considering he being shackled by, simply, a team and OL that wasn't good.

1992, at first, seemed like it was what the doctor ordered! Walker's first two games he rushed for over 100, and in that big MNF win vs Big D in Wk#5 (to make it 4-0 for Philly), he scored two TDs! From there, however, along with the team in-general, it was really as good as it got. He'd finish with his first 1,000 yard season since he was in Dallas, but Y/A-wise he mustered even less (4.0) than either of his two full seasons with the Vikings (4.2 each). He also scored just 8 TDs in '92 as opposed to 10 the previous year. Rushed for less than 750 in '93 (though 4.3 Y/A this time) and from there his RB-use/production dwindled, devolving in a minimally-used all-purpose but mostly ST-player, especially by the time he made his last two stops in NYG and (back to) Dallas.

Perhaps this should have been a thread to wait for Leonard to post, but (again) this Barkley acquisition reminds me of '92 (I attended the opener vs the Saints) so may as well start an all-round convo about them. Not just Herschel to talk of, but this being the year after the loss of Jerome Brown and the final year with Reggie White in the City of Brotherly. Bud Carson was there again at DC, fresh off that Classic '91 defensive output. I believe it was after their Wk#11 loss at his very future-team (dropping Birds to, now, 6-4) that Reggie was quoted complimenting Brett Favre's play which, in turn, rubbed #12 and others the wrong way.

Didn't Byars play TE?

Eagles did falter after that SB-lookin' 4-0 start, but each loss was close. That 20-10 loss in the rematch at Dallas (which had to put to end any possible championship optimism from September) was their most-lopsided defeat. But a loss is still a loss and, a couple contrary examples, they barely beat the Cards at home for their 5th win (big goal-line stand game) and allowed those notorious 2-14 Hawks to bring them into OT in Wk#15!

For what its worth, in addition to having the #7 offense & #6 D, they returned to the playoffs - winning their last four - and did something they couldn't do when Buddy was there and that's win a January game! Of course Buddy a better overall HC than Kotite but post-season-wise, maybe Richie FWIW was just slightly better in that very category. I'm not sure the Eagles win that 1st-Rd game had Buddy still been onboard.

Not just their last playoff year with that basic core, but pretty much the last year before the team's identity really started to move away from Buddy Ball. Another 4-0 start in '93 but, this time, not just another fall-off from there, but no playoffs at all. Randall out again opening week. Enter Bubby Brister. Mark Bavaro was added on that off-season! James Lofton was present as well, again with the change-of-identity that would really change-up some more by the time Ray Rhodes benched #12 for Rodney Peete!

Overall thoughts?

[Hail Casares]

For what its worth, in addition to having the #7 offense & #6 D, they returned to the playoffs - winning their last four - and did something they couldn't do when Buddy was there and that's win a January game! Of course Buddy a better overall HC than Kotite but post-season-wise, maybe Richie FWIW was just slightly better in that very category. I'm not sure the Eagles win that 1st-Rd game had Buddy still been onboard.


Overall thoughts?

I'm hesitant to retcon Kotite being any kind of good coach. That 1992 Saints team was likely the worst playoff team the Eagles faced in those Ryan/Kotite years. The Eagle beat them to start the year. They lost both their matchups to SF. They also only had 2 wins over teams with a winning record. The 9-7 Redskins and the 11-5 Dolphins.

Nearly every time the Saints played a high or even marginally quality opp that year (SFx2, Buf, Phi) they lost.

Here are the records of the teams that '92 Saints team beat(aside from Wash and Miami)

5-11
6-10(x2) - Falcons
5-11
6-10(x2) - Rams
4-12
5-11
2-14
4-12

[sheajets]

Kotite in 1992 wasn't quite yet the total burnout he would be when he joined the Jets in 1995 (leaving his own teams practice early to beat traffic)

Walker in 1992 was about 30 which was a scary number for running backs in the NFL historically, so it was quite an achievement for him to hit 1,000 even if it was a very very uneven season for him. From late Oct through early December he was not much of a factor at all on the ground or catching the ball (though interestingly he scored the bulk of his TD's during that stretch) He was an all time physical specimen in terms of conditioning but even with that a RB his age is going to have his bad/nicked up stretches and his good ones where he looks like his old self.

I weirdly remember highlights of that Cards goal line stand game. it was the classic circa 1992-1993 NFL game that started to pop up a lot more than the NFL would like in that era. Eagles 7 Cardinals 3. Final

1992's version of James Lofton was...Roy Green. Totally forgot he was an Eagle in 1991/1992 towards the tail end of his career. Later Art Monk would find his way to Philly after a stop with the Jets

That 1992 Eagles team went about as far as it could. They ran into a Dallas team that was on the precipice of greatness. And if not them then the 49ers would've beaten Philly soundly. I saw them as unquestionably the 3rd best team in the conference in 1992...and yes New Orleans was 12-4 with a respectable offense and the #1 ranked D, but I never believed in them. Especially after that game in Candlestick, where both teams came in 7-2, New Orleans led 20-7 in the 4th and San Fran imposes its will and finds a way to win it 21-20. Same thing happened against the Eagles in the Wild Card. #1 ranked D. Up 20-7 in the 3rd quarter, and they wilt

[Brian wolf]

Jerome Browns death affected that 1992 season more than the players realized. Walker wasnt going to do much behind that mediocre offensive line. Still, they had their chance to beat the Cowboys in the playoffs but doubt had already crept in after losing to them in Texas Stadium.

Once the Cowboys beat them again, the exodus of more players began because they could not only take advantage of free agency but probably didnt feel Cunningham could take them all the way. I felt if White and others could have stayed, they still had their chance but the pall over the city by Brown's death, made it harder for them to do so.

[74_75_78_79_]

For what its worth, in addition to having the #7 offense & #6 D, they returned to the playoffs - winning their last four - and did something they couldn't do when Buddy was there and that's win a January game! Of course Buddy a better overall HC than Kotite but post-season-wise, maybe Richie FWIW was just slightly better in that very category. I'm not sure the Eagles win that 1st-Rd game had Buddy still been onboard.


Overall thoughts?

I'm hesitant to retcon Kotite being any kind of good coach. That 1992 Saints team was likely the worst playoff team the Eagles faced in those Ryan/Kotite years. The Eagle beat them to start the year. They lost both their matchups to SF. They also only had 2 wins over teams with a winning record. The 9-7 Redskins and the 11-5 Dolphins.

Nearly every time the Saints played a high or even marginally quality opp that year (SFx2, Buf, Phi) they lost.

Here are the records of the teams that '92 Saints team beat(aside from Wash and Miami)

5-11
6-10(x2) - Falcons
5-11
6-10(x2) - Rams
4-12
5-11
2-14
4-12

I know a loss is a loss. But, man, those four defeats - each vs quality opponents - by a combined 13 pt is something worth solid mention, at least. Yes. just two wins vs above-500 teams. That Dolphin squad is seen as a 'soft' AFC 2nd-seed. but beating an 11-5 Marino/Shula team is beating an 11-5 Marino/Shula team. As for that other win? That Gibbs-led defending-Champ is among the stronger 9-7 teams ever. At least splitting with Philly and the Champs-to-be, scalding the Vikes at Minny 1st-Rd, then going out in-style by giving top-seed 14-2 San Fran a game at the 'Stick! Yes, terrible playoff-team but up-til-then remarkable-enough! But, yes, that soft-schedule otherwise! Good point-out at that! Didn't know until now!

Kotite in 1992 wasn't quite yet the total burnout he would be when he joined the Jets in 1995 (leaving his own teams practice early to beat traffic)

Walker in 1992 was about 30 which was a scary number for running backs in the NFL historically, so it was quite an achievement for him to hit 1,000 even if it was a very very uneven season for him. From late Oct through early December he was not much of a factor at all on the ground or catching the ball (though interestingly he scored the bulk of his TD's during that stretch) He was an all time physical specimen in terms of conditioning but even with that a RB his age is going to have his bad/nicked up stretches and his good ones where he looks like his old self.

I weirdly remember highlights of that Cards goal line stand game. it was the classic circa 1992-1993 NFL game that started to pop up a lot more than the NFL would like in that era. Eagles 7 Cardinals 3. Final

1992's version of James Lofton was...Roy Green. Totally forgot he was an Eagle in 1991/1992 towards the tail end of his career. Later Art Monk would find his way to Philly after a stop with the Jets

That 1992 Eagles team went about as far as it could. They ran into a Dallas team that was on the precipice of greatness. And if not them then the 49ers would've beaten Philly soundly. I saw them as unquestionably the 3rd best team in the conference in 1992...and yes New Orleans was 12-4 with a respectable offense and the #1 ranked D, but I never believed in them. Especially after that game in Candlestick, where both teams came in 7-2, New Orleans led 20-7 in the 4th and San Fran imposes its will and finds a way to win it 21-20. Same thing happened against the Eagles in the Wild Card. #1 ranked D. Up 20-7 in the 3rd quarter, and they wilt

A goal-line-stand is always an achievement! But that one in '92 vs Cards at the Vet was greatly assisted by Bugel's machismo in basically running up the gut every single play! I'm going to watch that one again as soon as I'm done writing this! I remember enjoying Matt Millen's commentary on the matter, lol (expressing his wish that he was in uniform down there as well as critiquing Phoenix's QB - forgot who he was - for not running hard enough).

I'm not going to make a contrarian out of myself over the general consensus of Rich Kotite as an NFC HC. But FWIW, 'Year Four' in, and following a '93 season in which 'Buddy Ball', safely said, was all rinsed out by the time it ended, he DID - as captain of the ship - muster a 7-2 start that featured a win vs GB in Wk#3 and, most important, delivering that 40-8 beating at, arguably (not "arguably", but agreed IMO), the Best team in the past 30 years (yes, it was an UPSET; SF's wheels didn't start rolling yet, but still)!

I, at the time, still wasn't too impressed with the 7-2 start. Two weeks later, following that convincer at home to Belichick's playoff-bound Browns, 26-7, yours truly, to my sports-betting/card-playing friends' bewilderment (and, no, not because of that loss; would have done so anyway), bet a nice wager on Buddy's Cards at Sun Devil to get revenge from two weeks prior (the game that put the Eagles at 7-2)! Everyone complimented me afterwards on the nice bet! I honestly would have bet on Zona had it been they minus-3.5.

But anyways, in hindsight, that 7-2 start is at least worth mention. Yes, 4-35 from there for Richie, but if he was truly AS BAD as he's perceived as having been while in Philly, you'd think the Birds would not have rallied to 8-8 as they did in '93 and then begin the season as they did the following year. Two 6-10, or less, seasons instead in such a case. But Kotite had to have, at least, been doing something right up through that 7th and final win in his last year in Philly before the "borrowed time" finally ran out. And...he wouldn't have won a playoff game either if he was...THAT BAD!

Jerome Browns death affected that 1992 season more than the players realized. Walker wasnt going to do much behind that mediocre offensive line. Still, they had their chance to beat the Cowboys in the playoffs but doubt had already crept in after losing to them in Texas Stadium.

Once the Cowboys beat them again, the exodus of more players began because they could not only take advantage of free agency but probably didnt feel Cunningham could take them all the way. I felt if White and others could have stayed, they still had their chance but the pall over the city by Brown's death, made it harder for them to do so.

Yeah, I at the time never even considered, nor remembering anyone else considering, the possibility of Walker maybe not being much more successful than he did in Minny due to that OL not being all that great either. Same may be said for many Eagle-fans now not considering just how injury-prone Barkley has been all along either (just optimism, optimism, optimism). Yes, again, that rematch at Dallas was the 'signal' for me that no Super Bowl was to be, Even the Birds winning their last 4 didn't fool me either (nor winning at NO 1st-Rd). Finally getting "the hang" of Philly, the ownership over them the next so-many years would begin!

[Brian wolf]

I didnt feel Barkley deserved that contract. He is injury prone just like Swift but Swift finally stayed healthy and gave them more bang for their bucks than Barkley will, especially with Kelce retired. We will see if Barkley proves me wrong but the Eagles need better depth than this past season.

[Hail Casares]

I know a loss is a loss. But, man, those four defeats - each vs quality opponents - by a combined 13 pt is something worth solid mention, at least. Yes. just two wins vs above-500 teams. That Dolphin squad is seen as a 'soft' AFC 2nd-seed. but beating an 11-5 Marino/Shula team is beating an 11-5 Marino/Shula team. As for that other win? That Gibbs-led defending-Champ is among the stronger 9-7 teams ever. At least splitting with Philly and the Champs-to-be, scalding the Vikes at Minny 1st-Rd, then going out in-style by giving top-seed 14-2 San Fran a game at the 'Stick! Yes, terrible playoff-team but up-til-then remarkable-enough! But, yes, that soft-schedule otherwise! Good point-out at that! Didn't know until now!

I think you're overrating that Vikings team. The NFC Central sucked that season. The only teams that Minnesota beat with winnings records were the 9-7 Packers and the 11-5 Steelers.

The 1992 Redskins being one of the stronger 9-7 teams ever is something I don't buy. They were no where near as good as they were the year before. The offense took a massive step back and I think the team bottoming out to 4-12 the next year is a good sign that it was a team/roster on a precipitous decline.

[7DnBrnc53]

That 1992 Eagles team went about as far as it could. They ran into a Dallas team that was on the precipice of greatness. And if not them then the 49ers would've beaten Philly soundly. I saw them as unquestionably the 3rd best team in the conference in 1992...and yes New Orleans was 12-4 with a respectable offense and the #1 ranked D, but I never believed in them. Especially after that game in Candlestick, where both teams came in 7-2, New Orleans led 20-7 in the 4th and San Fran imposes its will and finds a way to win it 21-20. Same thing happened against the Eagles in the Wild Card. #1 ranked D. Up 20-7 in the 3rd quarter, and they wilt

I think you are overestimating the 1992 49ers. They weren't that great, especially defensively. In the first 49er-Saint game, the Saints could have had the ball around the one with under 30 seconds to go, but a penalty backed them up, and they weren't able to pull it out. In the second game, they just choked like they always did.

Also, the Eagles played the 49ers that year, and only lost by six points at Candlestick. They had the ball around the 49er 15 late in the game, but just barely missed a first down on fourth down.

Those three games could have gone the other way, which would have made SF 11-5 instead of 14-2.

[lastcat3]

That 1992 Eagles team went about as far as it could. They ran into a Dallas team that was on the precipice of greatness. And if not them then the 49ers would've beaten Philly soundly. I saw them as unquestionably the 3rd best team in the conference in 1992...and yes New Orleans was 12-4 with a respectable offense and the #1 ranked D, but I never believed in them. Especially after that game in Candlestick, where both teams came in 7-2, New Orleans led 20-7 in the 4th and San Fran imposes its will and finds a way to win it 21-20. Same thing happened against the Eagles in the Wild Card. #1 ranked D. Up 20-7 in the 3rd quarter, and they wilt

I think you are overestimating the 1992 49ers. They weren't that great, especially defensively. In the first 49er-Saint game, the Saints could have had the ball around the one with under 30 seconds to go, but a penalty backed them up, and they weren't able to pull it out. In the second game, they just choked like they always did.

Also, the Eagles played the 49ers that year, and only lost by six points at Candlestick. They had the ball around the 49er 15 late in the game, but just barely missed a first down on fourth down.

Those three games could have gone the other way, which would have made SF 11-5 instead of 14-2.

THe 49ers were the only team that had anykind of shot of beating Dallas that year in the postseason. Those two teams weren't quite head and shoulders above everyone else like they were in '94 but they were still the best two teams in the league in 1992. And teams don't get a 14-2 record unless they are really really good. Every team has games during the regular season that could go the other way if certain things happened differently. THe fact that they manage to win those close games is what is important and the 49ers did in 1992.

They didn't call the 49ers and Cowboys matchups during that era the real Super Bowl for nothing. THere was a lot of truth to it. THe 49ers still had a lot of talent fron the late '80's Super Bowl teams and Dallas was building a extremely dominant dynasty that very well may have won three or four titles in a row if the salary cap and free agency didn't come around to break them up.

[7DnBrnc53]

They didn't call the 49ers and Cowboys matchups during that era the real Super Bowl for nothing. THere was a lot of truth to it. THe 49ers still had a lot of talent fron the late '80's Super Bowl teams and Dallas was building a extremely dominant dynasty that very well may have won three or four titles in a row if the salary cap and free agency didn't come around to break them up.

That was in 1994. In 1992, I didn't hear much about how the Cowboy-49er game was the real Super Bowl.

The Bills beat the 49ers that year in Candlestick, and the 6-10 Rams almost did as well. Also, besides the close calls with NO, they had some trouble on the road with 2-14 New England (Maurice Hurst dropped a key INT).