Senior Nominees

[BD Sullivan]

Lamonica getting repeatedly knocked out of games was part of what allowed Blanda to go on his magical run of heroic victories in 1970.

In truth, Lamonica had to tough enough to want to stay in the game. The fact that he was willing to have DMSO (a commercial solvent) rubbed on his arm week after week to keep his arm in shape should allay any doubts that he was tough enough to compete. Maybe one of the numerous side effects of DMSO was what offended his teammates: bad breath, which might have been ugly in tight huddles.

[BD Sullivan]

Stabler dropped out of the public eye pretty quickly after he left the NFL, although he did broadcasting on some NFL games for a couple years, and he did Alabama football games for a long time, and unless you lived in that part of the country, you rarely saw much of him.

Random, but he also did the radio for Birmingham Fire games.

He was signed to play in the WFL for the Birmingham Americans, but I think his contract situation imploded even before the league did.

[conace21]

Lamonica was also a significant contributor to the AFL Bills teams that reached the postseason in each of his four years and won a pair of titles. Lamonica actually tied for the AFL lead with 6 rushing touchdowns in 1964. He also had two of the finest postseason games ever, throwing 5 and 6 TD passes against KC in 1968 and Houston n 1969, respectively.

As for Stabler, I feel he is a worthy HOF candidate, but he was just as worthy two years ago. I would rather he had been selected two years ago, so he would have lived to see the honor. It is possible for voters to change their minds (Peter King has written how he had his mind changed about Art Monk) but death is not a valid reason for changing ones mind.

[oldecapecod11]

The Stabler-Stanfel nominations can only be a lose-lose affair.

If they are not elected, the opportunity to enshrine two far more worthy candidates will be lost.

If they are elected, the bar has been lowered once again and the vast sea of hope will become even more over-populated.

What will become of the ever-increasing body of both worthy and questionable?

[ChaseStuart]

The '80 Oilers had an easy schedule and went 8-3 in games decided by 6 or fewer points. That 11-5 record was more about good fortune than anything else. To me, Stabler's HOF case is all about what he did with Oakland, as there was nothing HOF caliber about his post-Raiders career.

As for Lamonica, I've always sided more with him than Stabler. Worth remembering: Stabler won exactly 7 more games with the Raiders than Lamonica, so it's not necessarily a huge difference in terms of longevity.

[SixtiesFan]

The '80 Oilers had an easy schedule and went 8-3 in games decided by 6 or fewer points. That 11-5 record was more about good fortune than anything else. To me, Stabler's HOF case is all about what he did with Oakland, as there was nothing HOF caliber about his post-Raiders career.

As for Lamonica, I've always sided more with him than Stabler. Worth remembering: Stabler won exactly 7 more games with the Raiders than Lamonica, so it's not necessarily a huge difference in terms of longevity.

How many here recall the 1970 season when George Blanda kept replacing Lamonica and pulling games out? In both 1970-71, Blanda would replace Lamonica late in the game.

It's also forgotten that Stabler beat out Lamonica in the 1972 preseason and started the opener in Pittsburgh. He faltered and Lamonica started the rest of 1972. Ironically, Stabler replaced Lamonica in the Immaculate Reception game and put the Raiders ahead 7-6 before the spectacular finale.

At the time it was said Lamonica couldn't cope with the zone defenses of the 1970's.

[BD Sullivan]

The '80 Oilers had an easy schedule and went 8-3 in games decided by 6 or fewer points.

One of those three losses was a crucial one late in the season at home against the Browns. The key play of the game came with the Oilers, trailing 17-14, and driving for a potential game-winning score (or game-tying FG) and Stabler getting a pass intercepted with 1:27 left at the Browns 24. To be fair, three fumbles and another Stabler interception, along with Toni Fritsch shanking a 38-yard FG with less than five minutes left didn't help. Stabler's connection to Casper was so strong that he tried to force a throw to him, even though Mike Barber was the intended option.

[conace21]

Stabler's 1980 season was bizarre. He finished second in the league in interceptions AND second in completion percentage. He had a game where he had more passes hit defenders' hands then hit the ground. (18 of 21 with 2 interceptions.)
After he left Oakland, he never threw more touchdown passes than interceptions, which may have been acceptable in the 1970's, but not in the 1980's.
Staubach and Bradshaw both saw a dramatic rise in their stats after the 1978 rules changes, whereas Stabler's stats mostly tanked.

[mwald]

.
Staubach and Bradshaw both saw a dramatic rise in their stats after the 1978 rules changes, whereas Stabler's stats mostly tanked.

One key difference: Staubach and Bradshaw stayed with the same organizations. Stabler didn't.

Stats are more the product of the organization someone plays in than people realize or care to admit.

***

I'm driving a car while scientists analyze my driving skills via measurements such as acceleration, braking, fuel usage, route traveled. Over time evidence shows I'm a very efficient driver.

Now plop me into a new metro area. Suddenly my braking is erratic, and likewise my acceleration. I miss turns in my route because I don't know where I'm going. Worried about my next turn, I run a couple red lights. It takes me longer to travel the same distance and I use more fuel.

Did I forget how to drive? No, my environment changed.

What if they give me a new vehicle (new offensive coordinator) but nothing else changes? Some dip in efficiency, but I'm still traveling the same path, still know where I'm going. I can concentrate on the car itself. Confident in where I am and where I'm going, I quickly pick up the nuances of the new vehicle.

It works the other way, too. A nobody changes teams and his new coach puts him in the right place to make plays. Is the player more talented than they were before? Doubtful.

Rare is the player who switches teams without an impact to performance, one way or the other. A few blue chippers can. They are the exception to the rule.

[SixtiesFan]

Stabler's 1980 season was bizarre. He finished second in the league in interceptions AND second in completion percentage. He had a game where he had more passes hit defenders' hands then hit the ground. (18 of 21 with 2 interceptions.)
After he left Oakland, he never threw more touchdown passes than interceptions, which may have been acceptable in the 1970's, but not in the 1980's.
Staubach and Bradshaw both saw a dramatic rise in their stats after the 1978 rules changes, whereas Stabler's stats mostly tanked.

In his last year with Oakland in 1979, Stabler had 3615 yards passing, most he ever had in a season.