Professional Football Researchers Association Forum
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1960 Western Final Game 3 Sat Nov 19 - Edmonton 4 @ Winnipeg 2 (18600) - Tommy-Joe Coffey, who had just missed a 19-yard FG, put a 15-yarder through, following a fake punt, with 10 seconds left to end the Bombers' three-year title reign. The Bombers had 306 yards rushing compared with Edmonton's 68, but their attack invariably floundered each time.
The Eskimos got a big break when Ken Ploen (playing with a suspected broken bone in his throwing hand) fumbled the ball with 1:45 remaining while trying to run out the clock. Ploen threw only 9 times during the game for 42 yards. Since Ploen was dealing with a broken bone in his throwing hand, maybe Grant should have used back-up QB Vern Cole (a rookie) if he was just trying to use up the clock (Cole did get playing time in Game 1). Too bad they didn't have Jim Van Pelt in 1960. After guiding Winnipeg in the '58 Grey Cup, he was having a monster season in 1959 with 31 td passes before getting injured. He was then drafted by the U.S. Air Force and never played pro football again:
1960 Western Final Game 3 Sat Nov 19 - Edmonton 4 @ Winnipeg 2 (18600) - Tommy-Joe Coffey, who had just missed a 19-yard FG, put a 15-yarder through, following a fake punt, with 10 seconds left to end the Bombers' three-year title reign. The Bombers had 306 yards rushing compared with Edmonton's 68, but their attack invariably floundered each time.
The Eskimos got a big break when Ken Ploen (playing with a suspected broken bone in his throwing hand) fumbled the ball with 1:45 remaining while trying to run out the clock. Ploen threw only 9 times during the game for 42 yards. Since Ploen was dealing with a broken bone in his throwing hand, maybe Grant should have used back-up QB Vern Cole (a rookie) if he was just trying to use up the clock (Cole did get playing time in Game 1). Too bad they didn't have Jim Van Pelt in 1960. After guiding Winnipeg in the '58 Grey Cup, he was having a monster season in 1959 with 31 td passes before getting injured. He was then drafted by the U.S. Air Force and never played pro football again:
This is an interesting question, four stand out to me.
1985 Bears v Dolphins in New Orleans.
The 1985 Bears showcased one of the most formidable defenses in football history, employing a strategy that seemed almost counterintuitive. Known as the 46 defense, it involved clustering three defensive linemen directly over the guards and center. The weakside defensive end positioned himself far outside the left tackle, creating a challenging angle for the offensive line. Outside linebackers filled the gaps created by these adjustments, while the strong safety positioned himself in the box behind the defensive line to bolster run support. The middle linebacker was a force to be reckoned with, ready to tackle anything that dared to come through the middle. Meanwhile, the free safety would either drop back for deep coverage or occasionally rush in for a blitz. The two cornerbacks were tasked with single coverage on every play, a daunting challenge, especially since the Bears didn’t have standout corners. The success of this strategy can be attributed to the Bears' exceptional defensive lineup, known for their incredible speed. The entire approach focused on pressuring the quarterback so swiftly that he had little opportunity to react. Dan Hampton, the central defensive tackle among the trio of linemen, compelled opposing teams to face him in one-on-one matchups, a challenge that most could not handle reliably. There was, however, one player who managed to do so, and we’ll discuss him shortly.
Chicago sportswriter Rick Telander summed it up best: “I think it took a sheer genius type of disconnect from reality to think that you could do this. Because that wide receiver if he gets past the corner he’s gone. You have to say that I don’t care about those obvious flaws in it. Because they are never going to get a chance to exploit that.”
Miami had the opportunity to showcase their strategy against the Bears, thanks to an offensive game plan that was spot on. Dan Marino, renowned for his lightning-fast release, could launch a pass in the blink of an eye. While he may not have been the quickest on his feet, his footwork was exceptional, allowing him to evade defenders effectively. Every play began with his hands positioned under the legendary Hall of Fame center, Dwight Stephenson. Although Stephenson's career lasted just eight years, he was an All-Pro center for five consecutive seasons alongside Marino, earning first-team honors four times and second-team once. He was undoubtedly the best center in the league, and the only player capable of outmatching Dan Hampton was Dwight Stephenson. He led an offensive line that allowed the fewest sacks for six straight years from 1982 to 1987.
With Stephenson neutralizing the primary threat in the middle, Marino could easily step up in the pocket to avoid edge rushers and deliver precise passes to his receivers.
Given this context, there’s no justification for the Bears to have lost to the Dolphins a second time; after all, wise teams learn from their past errors.
Buddy Ryan, the Bears' defensive coordinator, is undoubtedly intelligent, but his arrogance often overshadowed his capabilities, especially in his contentious relationship with head coach Mike Ditka. Ditka found himself unable to dismiss Ryan, as owner George Halas had made it clear that keeping Ryan as defensive coordinator was a non-negotiable part of Ditka's hiring. Ryan had a notorious reputation for being combative with his superiors while treating his subordinates with a familial affection. He aspired to lead, yet it was Ditka who held the head coaching position.
During the game against Miami on that Monday Night in the Orange Bowl, it became evident that the 46 defense was ineffective against Dan Marino. Wilbur Marshall struggled particularly, failing to cover effectively, even when the 46 occasionally shifted to a zone. Ditka was visibly frustrated on the sidelines, urging Buddy to substitute Marshall with a linebacker who could handle coverage duties. Mike Singletary, unfortunately, wasn’t suited for that role either.
Ditka had a point, but it was unlikely that Buddy would ever concede that. His stubbornness would prevent him from acknowledging any shortcomings or adapting the defensive strategy to better counter the Dolphins. They were fortunate to face the Patriots instead of Miami. I believe that if Ryan had been willing to set aside his pride, he could have devised a game plan that would have minimized Marino's impact and given the Bears' offense a better chance in a likely high-scoring matchup and Marino would not have missed the opportunities the way New England ultimately did
This would have been a very bad matchup for the Bears in the rematch v Miami.
1986 NY Giants v Cleveland in Pasadena
Cleveland’s running game would have been a tougher challenge for the Giants. That said, Cleveland would have not beaten the Giants on that Sunday in Pasadena. But I still think Cleveland’s running game would’ve been tougher for the Giants to stop early, but I think at halftime they would make the proper adjustments and the Giants still would’ve won going away in the 2nd half. And I also think they would’ve shut down Kosar, the same way they did with John Elway, in the 2nd half especially. Remember, Cleveland was without Earnest Byner throughout those playoffs, would he have given it a go in that Super Bowl? Most likely yes. Their best back was Kevin Mack that season. Curtis Dickey did not play in the AFCCG v Denver and would have been questionable going into that Super Bowl v Giants.
Phil Simms went 22-25 v Denver’s secondary. Cleveland’s secondary would have been more formidable (two all-pros in Dixon and Minnifield) for Simms and the Giants O. That said, Simms would be I’d say about 16-24 v Cleveland. Simms mentioned many times over the years that he was relieved the Broncos won that AFCCG. He felt the Browns' defense, specifically their all-pro DB's (Dixon and Minnefield), was a bad match up for the Giants. He's never had time to go into detail about why he felt that way, though, which I found interesting.
The Browns defense was no slouch. They had several Pro Bowlers- Bob Golic, Chip Banks, Clay Matthews. They had 2 of the best CBs in the NFL in Hanford Dixon and Frank Minnefield. That could be what he's talking about. However, In both the Jets game (AFC Divisional) and Broncos (AFCCG) games, they gave up big drives late that a "great" defense simply wouldn't do. In the Jets game, Freeman McNeil busted off a late TD in the 4th quarter that should have won the game...but the Jets were the Jets and went bonehead. And of course the Drive. Great defenses don't do that.
Also, you give Bill Belichick, who was the DC with the Giants at the time, two weeks to prepare for an opponent, Cleveland really would’ve had no shot the same way Denver didn't.
1987 Washington v Cleveland in San Diego
If it had been a Redskins v Browns Super Bowl that year, Each team would have entered the game with a bit of uncertainty. Cleveland’s (hypothetical) victory in Denver two weeks earlier in the AFCCG would have marked the largest postseason comeback in NFL history at that time, giving them a significant boost in momentum. However, their performance against the Broncos would have raised serious concerns about their previously formidable defense. On the other hand, Washington arrived at Super Bowl XXII after two rather unremarkable wins against the weakest NFC playoff teams, Chicago and Minnesota. Their offensive production in those games would have paled in comparison to what Cleveland achieved in just the second half and overtime against the 7th ranked Denver defense.
Cleveland’s offense would have been on fire heading into the game, having scored over 38 points in both of their playoff matches (not to mention they would have needed to score even more than that to defeat the Broncos in this alternate scenario). This would have appeared to give Cleveland a clear edge. Yet, while Washington's defense in 1987 was only average (6th in points allowed, 18th in yards), they managed to stifle the high-flying Minnesota Vikings offense to just 10 points in the NFC Championship game. Earlier in the playoffs, Minnesota had put up 44 points against the Saints’ 4th ranked defense in the Wildcard round and 36 against the 49ers’ top-ranked defense in the Divisional Playoffs.
On the flip side, Washington's offense would be up against the toughest defense they had encountered all season. While Cleveland and Denver had comparable passing defense statistics (notably, Denver was overwhelmed by Washington in Super Bowl XXII), Cleveland excelled in one crucial aspect: run defense. The Browns boasted the second-best rushing defense in the NFL, while Denver languished at 20th out of 28 teams. Despite facing challenges against Indianapolis and Denver, Cleveland's run defense could have received a significant boost in the Super Bowl with the return of injured Pro Bowl Nose Tackle Bob Golic. He had stated before the AFC Championship that if Cleveland made it to the Super Bowl, he would find a way to play despite his injured right arm. Had that occurred, Redskins running back Timmy Smith might have remained an unknown rather than becoming an unlikely record holder for rushing yards in Super Bowl history (204 yards against Denver in the actual Super Bowl XXII). Quarterback Doug Williams would have had to carry a heavier burden, while wide receivers Gary Clark and Ricky Sanders would have faced much tougher matchups against perennial Pro Bowlers Hanford Dixon and Frank Minnifield.
Prediction
Despite their impressive offensive performance leading up to the game, Cleveland’s offense would likely have faced challenges against the Redskins. Hall of Famer Darrell Green would have effectively contained Cleveland’s most reliable receiver, Webster Slaughter, while the league's 4th best sack unit, featuring Dexter Manley and Charles Mann, would have made things tough for the immobile Kosar. Cleveland would have needed to lean heavily on their running back duo of Kevin Mack and Earnest Byner, who would have been coming off one of the best games of his career. Washington's run defense in 1987 was average, ranking 12th in the league for yards allowed per attempt, but they had shown resilience in critical moments.
Cleveland's formidable defense would likely have stifled Washington's offensive efforts, while the Browns' well-rounded attack would effectively advance against the Redskins. With two versatile running backs, Cleveland would have posed a much tougher challenge for Washington, and Bernie Kosar would connect on several key passing plays. Although Joe Gibbs and his determined squad would put up a fight, they might lack the offensive strength needed to surpass the Browns. As a result, Cleveland takes home the Super Bowl victory, and Marty Schottenheimer probably remains with the team after 1988.
1998 Denver v Minnesota in Miami (Elway's final game)
This would have been the ultimate Super Bowl showdown on paper. It would have marked the first playoff encounter between two teams that each scored over 500 points during the regular season. The pre-game buzz would have centered around which team would be favored. Denver, as the reigning champion, boasted NFL MVP Terrell Davis and add to the fact that it was John Elway's final game in his Hall of Fame career, while the Vikings, the highest-scoring team in history, would have entered the game on a remarkable 10-game winning streak. I would guess the Vikings might have been slight favorites by 2 points, given that the NFC was generally regarded as the stronger conference, and Minnesota had decisively defeated the team Denver narrowly overcame in the previous Super Bowl, Green Bay.
While Minnesota held superior overall rankings, their rushing defense was somewhat lackluster. This would have allowed Terrell Davis to find success running against the Vikings' front line. Additionally, Minnesota's pass defense was below par, but they excelled in forcing turnovers, ranking 6th in the NFL. John Elway would have had a wealth of options, including the league's top tight end, Shannon Sharpe. Scoring wouldn’t have been an issue for the Broncos, which was crucial since they would need every point possible. Their passing defense ranked 26th, and cornerbacks Darrien Gordon and Ray Crockett would have struggled against the formidable duo of Randy Moss and Cris Carter. With former four-time 1,000-yard receiver Jake Reed in the slot and 500-yard tight end Andrew Glover, Minnesota would have been well-equipped to counter any offensive strategy Denver employed. On the bright side for the Broncos, their 3rd-ranked rushing defense would have limited Pro Bowl running back Robert Smith, but that likely wouldn’t have fazed the Vikings. From the start of the season, it was clear that Minnesota was intent on launching deep passes, and despite that, no one could find a way to stop them.
That hypothetical matchup v Minnesota was poised to be one of the most exhilarating shootouts in NFL history. Both teams were unlikely to hold each other back for long. If the Broncos could manage the clock effectively by getting Terrell Davis involved, which they did in the actual game v Atlanta going for 102 yards on 25 carries, they would be in a strong position. Once they established their play-action passing, they could potentially connect on some significant downfield plays. However, the Vikings also boasted several playmakers in their secondary. Given John Elway's history in Super Bowls—where he typically threw at least one interception in each appearance—the Vikings could reasonably anticipate creating a turnover or two. If one of Elway's errant throws landed in the hands of Vikings defensive back Jimmy Hitchcock, the situation could worsen for Denver, especially since Hitchcock had returned three of his seven interceptions for touchdowns in 1998.
Should Denver's offense falter, which they didn't v Atlanta in the actual game, they would find themselves in serious trouble, as their passing defense would likely be overwhelmed by the versatile Vikings aerial attack. While they could hope for some turnovers, Minnesota had committed the third fewest in 1998, whereas Denver ranked just 13th in forcing them. It’s easy to envision Randy Moss breaking loose for a couple of long touchdowns, opening up opportunities for his teammates to score even more. In the end though, it was #7's final game and he was not going to go out a loser. In the end, Denver would have made just enough plays to beat the Vikings, though it would be much closer than it actually was v the Falcons.
1960 Western Final Game 3 Sat Nov 19 - Edmonton 4 @ Winnipeg 2 (18600) - Tommy-Joe Coffey, who had just missed a 19-yard FG, put a 15-yarder through, following a fake punt, with 10 seconds left to end the Bombers' three-year title reign. The Bombers had 306 yards rushing compared with Edmonton's 68, but their attack invariably floundered each time.
The Eskimos got a big break when Ken Ploen (playing with a suspected broken bone in his throwing hand) fumbled the ball with 1:45 remaining while trying to run out the clock. Ploen threw only 9 times during the game for 42 yards. Since Ploen was dealing with a broken bone in his throwing hand, maybe Grant should have used back-up QB Vern Cole (a rookie) if he was just trying to use up the clock (Cole did get playing time in Game 1). Too bad they didn't have Jim Van Pelt in 1960. After guiding Winnipeg in the '58 Grey Cup, he was having a monster season in 1959 with 31 td passes before getting injured. He was then drafted by the U.S. Air Force and never played pro football again:
That 1980-81 Super Bowl in New Orleans would have been interesting if it had been San Diego v Philly
They had met in Week 13 that season in San Diego with the Chargers winning 22-21 over the Eagles. San Diego's D sacked Philly QBs 6 times (Jaworski 4 times, Pisarcik twice)
Jaworski was 20-31 201 yards, 2 TDs 0 INTs
Wilbert Montgomery had 18 carries, 61 yards rushing, 1 TD and 11 rec for 71 yards and another TD
Keith Krepfle had 5 rec, 78 yards, 1 TD
Dan Fouts was 20-28 342 yards, 2 TDs, 0 INTs
John Jefferson had 8 rec for 164 yards
Kellen Winslow had 6 rec for 89 yards, 2 TDs
In the Dome in New Orleans, it would have been more of the same from the first meeting, but I believe the Eagles would have had a better shot v San Diego than they ultimately did v the Raiders.
In the Dome in New Orleans, it would have been more of the same from the first meeting, but I believe the Eagles would have had a better shot v San Diego than they ultimately did v the Raiders.
It would have been closer than the Raiders-Eagle game was, but not a whole lot. I think that John Matuszak said that the Eagles looked like they were going off to Vietnam or something like that before the game. Don't see that changing against SD. 31-17, Chargers.
1998 Denver v Minnesota in Miami (Elway's final game)
The closest indicator of what may happened took place the next season on Halloween. The Vikings won 23-20. However, the Broncos were missing Elway to retirement, Atwater to the Jets, and TD and Sharpe to injuries. The Vikings weren't starting Randall, but they had Jeff George at QB, and pretty much everyone else playing from the 1998 season.
Good what-if scenarios but I believe Fred Dean would have made an impact against the Eagles in the Superdome. I think the Chargers win another close game, unless Fouts has turnovers. That was his undoing against the Raiders.
I also feel the Vikings win a shootout against the Broncos, though I feel Terrell Davis would have had a big game.
Brian wolf wrote: ↑Wed Jan 22, 2025 1:42 pm
Good what-if scenarios but I believe Fred Dean would have made an impact against the Eagles in the Superdome. I think the Chargers win another close game, unless Fouts has turnovers. That was his undoing against the Raiders.
I also feel the Vikings win a shootout against the Broncos, though I feel Terrell Davis would have had a big game.
I don't see the Eagles forcing the key turnovers that the Raiders did. There were several games that year where the Eagles lost the turnover battle. Also, when the Eagles played @SD (Wk 13), they were down 22-7 in the fourth quarter before making a late comeback to get it to within one before losing.
As for that Vikes-Broncos SB in 98, that would have been close to a pick-em game.
I think where the Vikings fall short in a hypothetical SB 33 is in pass coverage. Elway wouldn't have had much more of a problem with Jimmy Hitchcock and Corey Fuller than he did with Atlanta's guys -- especially considering how shredded the Vikings' linebacker corps would have been going into the game.
Super Bowl XI had been Raiders-Rams instead of Raiders-Vikings. There was a lot of criticism of the Vikings after their poor showing in Super Bowl XI, and in previous Super Bowls. There was some talk that the Rams would have had strong fan support since it was in Pasadena. And the Ram defense was hard to run on.
The Rams' weakness was their special teams and they would have had a rookie QB (Pat Haden) going against Stabler.
The blocked FG return hurt the Rams but Haden did lead a comeback from down 0-17 in that 76 NFC Champ game. His last interception, sealed the game for the Vikings. A great game from Foreman.
Getting back to Danny's post, Simms and the Giants were happy not to play against the Brown's corners--Minnefield,Dixon--simply because their wide receivers were pedestrian. Simms had an outstanding career considering the Giants had few weapons except for Bavaro, Morris and Hampton briefly and Meggett as a total purpose threat.
