Dick Vermeil

Discuss candidates for the Pro Football Hall of Fame and the PFRA's Hall of Very Good

Dick Vermeil

Postby IrishJimmy » Tue Jun 01, 2021 10:59 pm

Dick Vermeil should be a lock. Won division titles with three different teams. Took two down trodden franchises in Philadelphia and St. Louis to the Super Bowl in two different eras. Won the Super Bowl with St. Louis. It is a crime he is not in Canton.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby Eagles One » Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:54 pm

I brought this topic up back in January:


viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5933
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby IrishJimmy » Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:59 pm

Very good points. I made a strong case for him in a short
Book entitled - Blue Collar Birds. I think at worst he belongs in the HOVG.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby Brian wolf » Sat Jun 05, 2021 4:09 pm

My next five HOF Coaches/Hopefuls

Parker
Shaughnessy
Shanahan
Shaw or Coryell
Schottenheimer
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby GameBeforeTheMoney » Sat Jun 05, 2021 10:23 pm

Doing a piece on him now, so a lot of what he did with the three teams he coached is fresh on my mind. Great coach and agreed he should be a lock. Had he been able to get the Chiefs in the Super Bowl or if he'd stayed in coaching through the 80s, we might be talking Hall of Fame for him.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby Brian wolf » Sun Jun 06, 2021 3:58 pm

Vermeil will get voted in eventually because everyone knows he would have won another SB had he not resigned from the Rams. He believed in fundamentals, which the team got away from on defense and the offensive line under Martz, though you cant blame Martz for wanting to throw the football. Not utilizing Faulk enough as a runner and protecting Warner/Bulger enough, was Martz's downfall.

What I dont understand is why Marv Levy is in the HOF but not Dan Reeves?

Yes, Levy won four consecutive AFC championships and coached many great players but while Reeves lost all his SB appearances along with Levy, he went to three SBs in a four year period, then took another team in the NFC, to the SB.

Looking back, its obvious that the blowout SB losses took the luster off good coaching jobs by Reeves but Levy and the Bills were blown out in three of their four losses and he butchered the clock in the one SB he could have won.

The NFC was going through a dominant SB phase during both of Levy and Reeves' tenures but the Bills had more talent than the Broncos overrall, which is why Reeves should belong in the HOF as much as Levy, in my opinion.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby Brian wolf » Sun Jun 06, 2021 4:16 pm

I guess his success in Canada, winning a championship helped Levy make the Hall and rightfully so but I also believe that Reeves and his success as an NFL player, should help his HOF resume as well, though many writers, researchers, historians and fans believe that coaching and playing careers should be separate. I dont believe that at all. The summation of a playing, coaching, managing/scouting/administrative, or even a labor/union, or broadcasting/ambassador career, should all play a hand in getting someone elected, not just success in playing or coaching ...
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby GameBeforeTheMoney » Sun Jun 06, 2021 5:19 pm

I'm all for Marv Levy being in the Hall simply for his NFL resume.

That said, there's no question Dan Reeves belongs in the HOF, too. The old adage used to be, "Can you tell the history of the game without this guy?" In Reeves case, no. Led the NFL in touchdowns, threw a historic pass in one of the NFL's most historic games, was a player/coach (so, even if people want to split the two, you can make an exception with Reeves). After his playing career he was an assistant with Landry on SB teams, won the AFC Championship Games three out of four years as a head coach...then took Atlanta to the Super Bowl.

And one last important thing to add about Vermeil -- he was the first ever special teams coach in the NFL. Levy was the second, hired the same year by Philadelphia in response to Allen hiring Vermeil in Los Angeles.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby JuggernautJ » Sun Jun 06, 2021 6:24 pm

I agree that the entirety of an individual's career in and contribution to football should be considered as far as the Hall of Fame (and Hall of Very Good) are concerned.
And so does (or at least did) the HoF Selection Committee(s) (and the PFRA's too, I would think).

Steve Owen is listed as both a Tackle and a Head Coach at the HoF when his performance as either might well have garnered enshrinement.

And Walt Kiesling is in as both a Head Coach and a Guard when, one might opine, his performance as either individually might not have warranted consideration; saying, in effect, that it was his total contribution to the game over his 34 years in the NFL that merited enshrinement.

Likewise, Dan Reeves is in the HoVG as both a RB and Head Coach, suggesting that it was his lifetime performance that made him worthy of our Hall.
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Re: Dick Vermeil

Postby Eagles One » Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:37 pm

Brian wolf wrote:I guess his success in Canada, winning a championship helped Levy make the Hall and rightfully so but I also believe that Reeves and his success as an NFL player, should help his HOF resume as well, though many writers, researchers, historians and fans believe that coaching and playing careers should be separate. I dont believe that at all. The summation of a playing, coaching, managing/scouting/administrative, or even a labor/union, or broadcasting/ambassador career, should all play a hand in getting someone elected, not just success in playing or coaching ...



I think that if you include Reeves' playing career, it actually hurts his chances of getting in the HOF. He basically had two good years with the Cowboys.
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