Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '79?

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74_75_78_79_
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Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '79?

Post by 74_75_78_79_ »

This despite they not yet having #34 and not making the playoffs whereas in both '78 & '79 they, of course, not only make the playoffs but the AFCCG. They didn't make the playoffs in '75 despite the 10-4 finish but, for one, only four teams made it in per conference and also the division they were in! In the two latter years, they only had Pittsburgh to deal with within the division (and a budding on-the-cusp Browns team). But in '75, it was the 12-2 (may as well say 13-1) 'Burgh AND an 11-3 Paul Brown Bengals squad! Both teams swept them although Houston did give the Steelers a good game at Three Rivers and could have won either of those games vs Cincy. They were undefeated (10-0) outside that quartet of defeats! And it's not as if the rest of the schedule was cake! They beat Washington, Miami, and 11-3 AFCCG-participant-to-be, Oakland. Yes, the other two mentioned not playoff teams in '75, but posted winning records just the same. The Dolphins were also 10-4.

In addition to it, actually, being his best win-%age in a regular season anyways (10-4 is better than 11-5), '75 would have to be considered Bum Phillips' best one-year performance as a head coach! What was it that enabled them to come out-of-nowhere to post such a season only TWO YEARS REMOVED from those back-to-back 1-win disasters, and why the (not one, but two-year) letdown that followed until Earl - and then Leon a year later - arrived?
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Re: Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '

Post by 7DnBrnc53 »

The 1975 team did have a solid resume, and they finished higher in points allowed than the 78 and 79 teams, but I don't think they were better, especially compared to the 1979 team (the most talented of the three teams, in my opinion).

It's too bad that Sid Gillman wasn't a terrible GM in 1973 and 74. In April and May of 1973, he made three stupid trades:

April 30: Traded 1974 second-round pick to Bills for DE Al Cowlings.
May 9: Traded 1974 first-round (turned out to be first overall) and third-round picks to Cowboys for DE Tody Smith and WR Billy Parks.
May 15: Traded HOF S Ken Houston to Redskins for five average players.

Also, it's too bad that the Oilers got rid of Steve Largent in 1976. Imagine them taking on the Steelers in the late-70's with Largent, Too Tall Jones, Ken Houston, and whoever they would have drafted in the second and third rounds of the 1974 draft (they could have had a shot at guys like Jack Lambert, Steve Nelson, Dave Casper, Matt Blair, Claudie Minor, and Delvin Williams).
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Re: Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '

Post by GameBeforeTheMoney »

A really thought-provoking question. I have done a lot of work on the Oilers and never thought about this.

They were younger in 75, and although no Earl Campbell they did garner over 1600 rushing yards between three backs. Pastorini was healthier than in the other two seasons.

Of course Campbell came in 78, Leon Gray in 79, but they had more injuries. Billy White Shoes missed the majority of those two seasons. Pastorini had injuries both of those seasons although he didn't miss many games. There were injuries on the OLine and LB in 79, but I agree the 79 team was the best. They played together so well by that point, the family atmosphere, the fan spirit, it all contributed to a better team. Plus, OC King Rice had modified the offense to give Pastorini more flexibility at the line of scrimmage before 78 and thus his two best statistical seasons and playoff success. And Rich Caster was a very good TE/WR.

I do have a bit of a different opinion about Sid Gillman, he switched to the 3-4 defense and after Bum and Ed Biles told him they needed a good nose tackle to pull it off, he went out and got Curley Culp in a trade for John Matuzak which also brought a first-round draft pick that turned out to be Robert Brazile. That's one of the best trades in Oiler history. And I kind of can see how Largent would have gotten overlooked with Burrough and White Shoes there. They sure could have used Largent in 79 though.

The Ken Houston deal was unquestionably a huge mistake though. They did, however, have Vernon Perry at strong safety and he was a huge reason they beat Denver in the playoffs (with the deflection in the end zone at the end of the game), the record 4 picks against SD in the div round, and the pick 6 vs Pitt. But yeah, what could have been if Largent was on the team in 78 and 79, a healthy Kenny Burrough in the 79 offs, a healthy White Shoes returning kicks and receiving as well, and Ken Houston likely playing strong safety and Perry likely would have been at corner and that's almost for sure a better defense even though both JC Wilson and Greg Stemrick were pretty good. If they had been able to draft Lambert, I think that would have shifted all the power to Houston in 79 since Jack Ham was lost for the offs that year...and of course, who knows what happens in the 70s if the Steelers don't have Lambert.

Now, even if the 75 team might have been better, 79 was certainly the best chance they had to beat the Steelers in the playoffs, I'll say that. And they had a real chance to win that game even with an injured Pastorini and having to play Guido Merkins at receiver.
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7DnBrnc53
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Re: Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '

Post by 7DnBrnc53 »

I do have a bit of a different opinion about Sid Gillman, he switched to the 3-4 defense and after Bum and Ed Biles told him they needed a good nose tackle to pull it off, he went out and got Curley Culp in a trade for John Matuzak which also brought a first-round draft pick that turned out to be Robert Brazile. That's one of the best trades in Oiler history. And I kind of can see how Largent would have gotten overlooked with Burrough and White Shoes there. They sure could have used Largent in 79 though.
Gillman did a good job as HC there. I agree with you. Massive upgrade over the over his head Peterson. He put them on the road to contention.
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Re: Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '

Post by Brian wolf »

Bum had a tough team that was good in 1977 as well.
Pastorini was injury prone but also needed more weapons.
Burrough was okay but Billy Johnson was a disappointment as a receiver. Largent at least had good hands but they never realized how much he could improve. They gave up later on with Steve Tasker as well.
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Re: Were the Oilers better in 1975 than they were in '78 & '

Post by 74_75_78_79_ »

Excellent, recent article here...

https://africa.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/ ... l-campbell

Yes, "players' coach" does indeed have a stigma attached to it. It, apparently, means that such a coach is too friendly to his players thus preventing full winning potential. And a head coach who also is a GM...too tough to be successful being the multi-task-ed-ness, at hand!

Yet, I would have to anoint Bum as the 'Godfather' of "players' coaches"! Also one of the better all-time HC/GMs as well! Not bad at all considering the '78 & '79 Steelers, mind you, being the reasons they don't represent the AFC in either of those years (absolutely no crime) and - despite winning 10 of 10 otherwise - not getting into the playoffs in '75 because of the, arguably, best-team-EVER and Paul Brown's arguably best Cincy squad BOTH being in their same division!

A city rallying, waiting at the airport, after their team loses a Super Bowl - as was actually the case with Buffalo after SBXXV, cheering for Norwood - is one thing; but a city making a 'Beatles-arriving-at-JFK' after coming back from a...34-5 conference championship defeat?? And then making an even GREATER presence the following year???? Yes! Brings a tear to my eye after reading about that and this from a, here, Steeler-fan!!

Being that they DID split with the 'Burgh in the '78 & '79 seasons ('77 too), beating the Cowboys at Dallas on Turkey Day '79 has to be considered the 'heart' of the 'Luv ya Blue' Era! Campbell-vs-Dorsett ('76-vs-'77 Heisman winner)! NFL Films doing such justice in portraying the contrasting silhouetted Stetson & Fedora figures via the light from the 'hole' in the roof (so God can see "his team" play)! I do remember Turkey Day '79! It was the first month living at my new house; beginning of 3rd grade, Iran Hostage Crisis suddenly taking over, etc! But I didn't follow sports yet! That would be the following fall!

All that I remember was that after dinner, my bedroom was being moved from the second floor up to the third floor (to my little sister's dismay, the whole entire floor to myself)! Sure enough, the game was on in the living room! I simply should have sat in front of the tube and witnessed some history! I have, however, seen that the entire game is currently available on a well-known resource! Commercials included, I think. Perhaps I can check out that Classic 30-24 affair there!

Although they did get another year older, and Pastorini now off to the west coast, I'd like to think their regular season in '80 wasn't a far step down from the years prior. #34's Tour De Force year, after all, was that very season! His football card was the ever-so-elusive 'Ace of Spades' of football cards! My best-friend, years ago, hooked me up with a very vintage 1980 rendition of his white road jersey!

Yes, Stabler was now the QB and was now past his prime. Oilers also grabbed a past-peak Casper too. 'The Snake', of course, was a Raider through-and-through. But if he HAD to play elsewhere (if he HAD to play elsewhere)...a Bum Phillips team, and the laidback/'fun' atmosphere it entailed, was clearly the fit!

They didn't beat as many quality teams in ’80 as they did in '79. But, in fairness to them, they didn't have the opportunities! They missed the Bills, Chargers, and Raiders only having to play the Browns & Steelers twice (splitting with both), the Pats on MNF (whom they beat, I watched the game at the time; I consider it the 'heart' of their '80 campaign), and only having to play (and also beat) the 9-7 Vikings cross-conference!

With the Steelers now out-of-the-way, the Oilers again finished 11-5 as did every other AFC playoff-qualifier in 1980. But another team still won the division anyway! And it didn't help that the Lombardi-winner-to-be had to be their first playoff opponent as opposed to not having to meet them until the AFCC!

Following sports for the very first time, I learned that a coach can actually get fired despite having a good season when, after coming back from Christmas vacation, my 4th grade classmates informed me that Bum Phillips got fired because Houston lost the playoff game! I believe he was on Merv Griffin right after that. How nervy it was for Adams to actually ask Wade to still be on their staff!! Really?? I then, recently, hear that the firing was because Bum failed to report a player's drug-use not until after the season ended. And also because he didn't want to fire an assistant.

In either event, in a parallel life, I would have been a fan as well thus still feeling nostalgia for that period (their uniforms were close-to-perfection). And likely would have stopped being a fan after the firing. I had a friend in 4th grade who was an Oiler-fan at the time but suddenly became a Dallas-fan afterward. I did, indeed, blame him for picking Dallas, but maybe not blame him for jumping off the Biles ship.

For what it's worth, the 4-2 start in '81 could be seen as an 'extension' of 'Luv ya Blue' before finally crumbling for good until...Glanville. It must be painful for Houston football fans who are still bummed that the Oilers left and simply don't want to jump to Big D. The Texans still have yet to mimic that '75, '78-thru-'80 magic! The opener over Dallas in 2002, and JJ Watt, simply hasn't been enough!
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